Top 5 Timeless Indie Rock Releases

[bitterfruit]

Consider the following for an Indie Rock album (on this list) to be considered timeless:

1. Released between 1985 and 2003. We'll do all the years prior later, when I am finished eating my deep fried mars bars with Joseph and after I finish proving that P. Bobby is not a sell out for christ's sake.
2. "Timeless releases" (on this list) should be considered works that could potentially span any generation, decade, etc. Someone hearing Spoon's "Girls Can Tell" in 10 years will shit themselves the same way I did in 2001.
3. "Timeless release" cannot be an EP.
4. Artist cannot be named twice (just to keep things interesting), but can be mentioned via a solo release unless major line-up changes a la 10,000 Maniacs.
5. Release cannot have been originally on a major label. Mini-majors are accepted. Though it's a great record, Spoon's "Series of Sneaks" cannot count since it was originally on Elektra even when you are referring to the Merge release.
6. Lip synching to noted release on a music video or at a music award are grounds for withdrawal.
7. Artist must have at least two releases including noted record.
8. Exception in small cases, but Liz Phair can only be mentioned when proper credit is given to the people who actually wrote her songs.
9. Consider older releases that you still listen to, not just records from your new playlist or that sit on your shelf looking pretty. Nirvana's "Nevermind" is a great record, but do you still listen to it? This is also giving DGC mini-major status.
10. Limit the response to five Indie Rock records (because I am a dick). Limiting the scope to this will allow for future lists for post-rock, space rock, hip-hop etc.


Here are my timeless releases:

1. Spoon - Girls Can Tell
2. GBV - Bee Thousand
3. Superchunk - Foolish
4. The Wedding Present - George Best Plus
5. The New Pornographers - Electric Version (give this record time, and it will transcend the ages)

[johansen smith]

01 "Come on Die Young" Mogwai
02 "Didn't It Rain?" Songs: Ohia (perfectly captured the slow semi-folk sound movement of Palace/BPB, S:O, Papa M, etc. at it's finest)
03 "Bright Flight" Silver Jews
04 "Measure" Matt Pond PA (when the dust settles, 10 years from now, Matt Pond PA will be the band everyone wishes they'd listened to first)
05 "Alien Lanes" Guided by Voices

I WISH I could say:
"A Series of Sneaks" Spoon
"Black Love" the Afghan Whigs

[Paul]

Cripes! The 1985 cutoff is killing me here...

The Dangtrippers, Days Between Stations (Dog Gone, 1989)
Dharma Bums, Haywire (Frontier, 1989)
Archers of Loaf, Vee Vee (Alias, 1995)
Sonic Youth, EVOL (SST, 1986)
Bedhead, What Fun Life Was (Trance Syndicate, 1994)

[bitterfruit]

Originally posted by Paul
Cripes! The 1985 cutoff is killing me here...
Bedhead, What Fun Life Was (Trance Syndicate, 1994)

I especially agree with this choice. What a standout album?!

[Salman]

I wouldn't say top 5 but...

Neutral Milk Hotel - In The Aeroplane Over the Sea [Merge, 1997]
The Aislers Set - The Last Match [Slumberland, 2000]
Sonic Youth - Sister [SST, 1987]
Young and Sexy - Stand Up For Your Mother [Mint, 2002]
Sebadoh - III [Homestead, 1991]

[otto midnight]

yr living all over me- dino jr.




so good. so so good.

[vesper]

Olivia Tremor Control, Black Foliage: Animation Music Vol. 1 (Flydaddy, 1999)
Gastr Del Sol, Camoufleur (Drag City, 1998)
Dismemberment Plan, Emergency & I (DeSoto, 1999)
Built to Spill, There's Nothing Wrong with Love (Up, 1994)
Unwound, New Plastic Ideas (Kill Rock Stars, 1994)

:( I'm a little too sensitive to "recency effect". Anyway, I really wish I could put The Pixies, Surfer Rosa and Spoon, A Series of Sneaks on there but their affiliation with Elektra fucks it all up. The other closest one that I had trouble choosing was Tortoise, TNT. I thought Do Make Say Think, & Yet & Yet would go, but I've only had a year with it and decided to play it safe.

[jef]

Husker Du - New Day Rising
Pavement - Wowee Zowee
Guided By Voices - Bee Thousand
The Fall - This Nation's Saving Grace
Unwound - Leaves Turn Inside You

[jef]

Oh yeah, and Olivia Tromor Control - Dusk at Cubist Castle

[mac]

one:


De Artsen - Conny Waves With A Shell (Glitterhouse/Brinkman)

[Paul]

Originally posted by vesper
...Anyway, I really wish I could put The Pixies, Surfer Rosa...on there but their affiliation with Elektra fucks it all up.

Feel free to put it on there! It was originally released on 4AD via Rough Trade, neither of which is a major label.

[chabysinisterra]

slint - spiderland
silkworm - developer
pavement - crooked rain, crooked rain
netural milk hotel - on avery island
yo la tengo - electropura

[vesper]

Originally posted by Paul
Feel free to put it on there! It was originally released on 4AD via Rough Trade, neither of which is a major label.

Then it's done! Put Surfer Rosa as numero uno and move everything else down one.

For posterity...

The Pixies, Surfer Rosa (4AD, 1988)
Olivia Tremor Control, Black Foliage: Animation Music Vol. 1 (Flydaddy, 1999)
Gastr Del Sol, Camoufleur (Drag City, 1998)
Dismemberment Plan, Emergency & I (DeSoto, 1999)
Built to Spill, There's Nothing Wrong with Love (Up, 1994)

[Squall91]

1. Pixies - Doolittle
2. Modest Mouse - The Lonesome Crowded West
3. Sonic Youth - Daydream Nation
4. Pavement - Wowee Zowee
5. Pretty Girls Make Graves - Good Health

[johansen smith]

Originally posted by Squall91

2. Modest Mouse - The Lonesome Crowded West
4. Pavement - Wowee Zowee


both good choices that nearly made my list.

[Futureman]

Squall,

Great choices! Our lists our similar:

1. Pavement: Wowee Zowee (so brilliant)
2. Pixies: Doolittle
3. Sonic Youth: DN
4. Silver Jews: American Water

(5 way tie for fifth. So I cheated).

5a. Modest Mouse--LCW
5b. Gastr Del Sol--Camoufleur
5c. Liars--They Threw us all in a Trench...
5d. Wilco--YHF
5e. Radiohead--OK Computer

[bitterfruit]

I had real difficulty picking the most timeless Pavement album. I settled at "Brighten The Corners," but then recanted and chose "Terror Twilight" instead....I think.

[tinobeat]

really? interesting... care to expound?

I'm not criticizing your choice, but TT, despite being a great album, doesn't strike me as being spectacular compared to the others.

I don't hesitate for a moment saying that Wowee Zowee is the answer to every question.

[vesper]

I think Doolittle would make more of my lists if it weren't for the crap that is "Silver." That being said, "Mr Grieves" - "Crackity Jones" is one of the finest one-two punches on an album.

[bitterfruit]

Originally posted by tinobeat
really? interesting... care to expound?

I'm not criticizing your choice, but TT, despite being a great album, doesn't strike me as being spectacular compared to the others.

I don't hesitate for a moment saying that Wowee Zowee is the answer to every question.

If "Wowee Zowee" didn't have so much filler, I think it would be a stronger contender for a more lasting album. Many may disagree, but when I think of WZ, I think of a disjointed collection that would have been better off as a shorter, really nice EP.

In my opinion, "Terror Twilight" has better songs, better sequencing, and no/less filler. I can listen to TT year after year and I don't get bored or the itchy finger for the next button.

[Ladt]

Ok computer's not Indie!

[johansen smith]

Originally posted by Ladt
Ok computer's not Indie!

hahahah, Radiohead's about as indie as Jefferson Starship.

[Ladt]

It was on a major label.

[tinobeat]

Originally posted by bitterfruit
If "Wowee Zowee" didn't have so much filler, I think it would be a stronger contender for a more lasting album. Many may disagree, but when I think of WZ, I think of a disjointed collection that would have been better off as a shorter, really nice EP.

In my opinion, "Terror Twilight" has better songs, better sequencing, and no/less filler. I can listen to TT year after year and I don't get bored or the itchy finger for the next button.

see, I don't hear the "filler" on WZ. it works perfectly in my mind as a long album with three distinct parts. after I lost the CD and bought it for the second time on vinyl, the three sides (side 4 is blank) perfectly corresponded to the three distinct movements of the album, which made me really happy. there's short, seemingly throwaway songs, but I think it works the best as a full "album" out of all the pave albums.

TT is chock fulla filler for me, though the best songs on it are some of the best pave songs.

[aJeremy]

Cocteau Twins, "Heaven or Las Vegas"
Rodan, "Rusty"

[abevigoda]

Back in my day, you Wowee Zowee kids were the minority. I love that album but Summer Babe and Silence Kit will always bring me a much warmer feeling when I hear those first few notes. I really dislike Brighten the Corners for a number of reasons (no rock album should ever reference menopause or lumbar pain). Terror Twilight is generally entertaining with a few exceptions. That said, I throw my hat:

Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain
Daydream Nation
American Water
Doolittle
In lieu of 13 songs, Repeater

[Miss Tasty Princess]

Wowee Zowee is my favorite Pavement album but I have nothing else to add to this thread as no way in Hell can everyone agree on five definitive "indie" (or otherwise) releases. For example, I've never cared for The Pixies, I've never heard Spoon and I've always felt Daydream Nation was disappointing compared to the three albums preceeding it but it was a double album so it must be their "definitive statement" as artists, right?

[abevigoda]

That, or I suppose it's possible people like it on its own merits.

[bitterfruit]

Originally posted by Mr.HCI
Wowee Zowee is my favorite Pavement album but I have nothing else to add to this thread as no way in Hell can everyone agree on five definitive "indie" (or otherwise) releases. For example, I've never cared for The Pixies, I've never heard Spoon and I've always felt Daydream Nation was disappointing compared to the three albums preceeding it but it was a double album so it must be their "definitive statement" as artists, right?

That's kind of what the point of the thread is. Not everyone will agree, but that's part of the fun.

[Miss Tasty Princess]

Originally posted by abevigoda
That, or I suppose it's possible people like it on its own merits. Certainly. Sorry if I sounded bitchy there.

[abevigoda]

No worries...didn't mean to reply bitchily (hey, why not?) in kind...that is the fun of these sorts of discussions...it becomes less so when invective starts being tossed around as it is, alack, only rock and roll...

[9000]

gbv - bee thousand
yo la tengo - electropura
jsbx - orange
sonic youth - daydream nation
boogie down productions - criminal minded

other top five:
pussy galore - right now
pavement - slanted and enchanted
black flag - damaged
eric b and rakim - paid in full
de la soul - three feet high and rising

[pony]

1. crooked rain, crooked rain - Pavement
2. moonpix - Catpower
3. exile in guyville (go ahead! i don't care if your argue it, that album changed my life...) - Liz Phair
4. Victoria - Cocteau Twins
5. Elliot Smith - Elliot Smith (OK now I'm waiting for the s**t to hit the fan...)

[Futureman]

I'd like to add Jefferson Starship to my list. Scratch that. Just make it Starship.

[Dayne1234]

These 5 are a no brainer for me...


1. "Doolittle" The Pixies
2. "Slanted and Enchanted" Pavement
3. "Let It Be" The Replacements
4. "Icky Mettle" Archers of Loaf
5. "Bee Thousand" Guided by Voices


I've always thought that "Slanted" and "Icky Mettle" are the top two (tied) "Holy Grail of Indie" albums.

Great stuff!

[c. leo]

Let It Be Ñ Replacements
New Day Rising Ñ HŸsker DŸ
Clam Dip & Other Delights Ñ Soul Asylum
Love Is The Law Ñ The Suburbs
Hollywood Town Hall Ñ The Jayhawks

(snicker)

[jef]

Ahem, Let it Be was released in 1984.

[Dayne1234]

"Let It Be" by The 'Mats is Timeless and Indie Fundamental. I say vote it in and bend the rules. :)

[Paul]

The ineligibility of Let It Be was what led to my "Cripes!" comment on the first page of this thread.

[jef]

Yeah that got me too, although since major label stuff is being added (OK Computer, Daydream Nation) I'll add "Tim" to mine.

[abevigoda]

Daydream wasn't major...not that it matters.

[jef]

It wasn't? Shows how much I know. My copy is on DGC.

Although I do have a copy of 'Sister' that was on SST, and my girlfriends copy is on DGC.

[saved]

Mr. HCI said:
I've never heard Spoon

That makes me want to cry.

[Squall91]

Crap, now that I think about it, the PGMG could be replaced by a lot of other albums...

...if not for the release date barriers...

[bmmello]

Guided by Voices - Bee Thousand
The Wrens - Secaucus
Pavement - Terror Twilight
Yo La Tengo - And then nothing turned itself inside out
Slowdive - Souvlaki

[Miss Tasty Princess]

Originally posted by saved
That makes me want to cry. That's OK, there's probably tons of stuff I love that you've never heard either. There's too much good music in the world to have the time to hear it all.

[SlackMF]

I'd be too afraid you wouldn't respect me in the morning if I said:

1. Delgados - Peloton
2. Eleventh Dream Day - The Stalled Parade
3. Sleepyhead - The Brighter Shore
4. Heatmiser - Mic City Sons
5. Kid Silver - Dead City Sunbeams

So I’d probably play it safe and win you over with:

1. Yo La Tengo - Electr-o-pura
2. Pavement - Wowee Zowee
3. Pixies - Doolittle
4. Spoon - Kill the Moonlight
5. New Pornographers – Mass Romantic

While all the while I would secretly be thinking about:

1. PJ Harvey - Dry
2. Trans Am - Red Line
3. Beta Band - 3 EPs
4. Chavez - Ride the Fader

And last but not least, my namesake:

5. Superchunk - No Pocky for Kitty

[blah]

now how did we forget loveless?

[SlackMF]

Bedhead's "What Fun Life Was" had it's day on this thread. Loveless is out cuz it came out on Sire/Warner I believe.

[blah]

i made the bh comment b/c of the thread's recognition. forgot the mbv major connex. just goes to show a good album is a good album i guess. hmm... for another unmentioned that i think is great is one sock missing by the grifters, which i can't seem to find right now.

[SlackMF]

I read your sentence about bedhead with the totally wrong inflection. Sorry! I agree with you on the grifters and I'd also like to see someone list Unrest - I cheated really bad and still couldn't fit them in. Oh well...

[blah]

gets in the way sometimes. another good one imo: in search of manny- luscious jackson. not a favorite, essential, an album etc. but dang if i don't enjoy listening to it when it's on. perhaps this thread is unravleing... perhaps it should. or maybe i should turn my wmp random off.

[Squall91]

Originally posted by blah
now how did we forget loveless? Wasn't it on Sire, which is part of Warner? Or is Sire part of the "allowed major labels" list?

Cause they should be.

[bitterfruit]

Originally posted by SlackMF

5. Superchunk - No Pocky for Kitty

Mass props to "No Pocky For Kitty." I was torn between this record and "Foolish" for the 'Chunk's most timeless record. Though NPFK is great, "Foolish" is where my heart is.

[blah]

atcq- low end theory!

[jef]

I too prefer Foolish to No Pocky for Kitty

[DefenderOfPants]

1. the smiths - strangeways, here we come
2. the magnetic fields - the charm of the highway strip
2. pavement - crooked rain, crooked rain
3. pulp - seperations
4. jonathan richman - surrender to jonathan
5. hefner - breaking god's heart

[anagrama]

Originally posted by Squall91
1. Pixies - Doolittle
2. Modest Mouse - The Lonesome Crowded West
3. Sonic Youth - Daydream Nation
4. Pavement - Wowee Zowee
5. Pretty Girls Make Graves - Good Health

my list would be almost identical to that.

except replace Spiderland with the Pretty Girls... album.

[stewrat]

in no order:

american music club - engine
guided by voices - bee thousand
blake babies - sunburn
superchunk - foolish
scrawl - velvet hammer

[bitterfruit]

Originally posted by stewrat
in no order:
blake babies - sunburn


When did Disney buy Hollywood Records?

[PharmRobot]

In no particular order, here's my five:

Smog -- Knock Knock

Sonic Youth -- Sister

Yo La Tengo -- I Can Hear the Heart Beating As One

Come -- Near Life Experience

Breeders -- Pod (It was re-released by Elektra in what -- 1994? -- but, umm.... I'm putting it anyway)


And maybe if I'd written this yesterday or tomorrow, I'd probably include:
Silver Jews -- American Water
Superchunk -- No Pocky for Kitty

[johansen smith]

Originally posted by PharmRobot

Smog -- Knock Knock


ooo, that IS a good choice.

[styrofoamplates]

hmm....

pavement- slanted and enchanted

yo la tengo- electropura

built to spill- keep it like a secret

neutral milk hotel- in the aeroplane over the sea

death cab for cutie- we have the facts and we're voting yes


its suprising to see so many people who actually like wowee zowee.

[vesper]

Unfortunately, that BTS album is on a major.

[star sign]

1. Lilys - A Brief History Of Amazing Letdowns
2. Lilys - Eccsame The Photon Band
3. Sebadoh - Bakesale
4. Guided By Voices - Under The Bushes, Under The Stars
5. Teenage Fanclub - A Catholic Education

[styrofoamplates]

damn, you're right. okay, belle and sebastian- if you're feeling sinister it is.

[philipmarlowe]

I still listen to Nevermind.

Anyway, I don't know about a top five, but these are five albums that will still baffle and terrify people in 100 years the way they baffle and terrify me today.

U.S. Maple-Long Hair in Three Stages
Dead C-Harsh 70s Reality
Kid 606-Down With the Scene
Xiu Xiu-A Promise
Lightning Bolt-Wonderful Rainbow

[jsbxfan]

sebadoh - "bubble & scrape"

[Artgeek]

Dang, I think Perfect From Now On is major label too. Well, regardless, it would be on my list if I could use it.

1. A Pavement album, though this constantly changes for me. I never think their albums are that good when I listen for the first time, but over repeated listens it gets harder for me to choose which is their best. I'll just pick S&E I think.

2. Sonic Youth - Daydream Nation ---- cohesive, sprawling, and a total head rush from start to finish.

3. Pixies - Doolittle ---- Actually I don't think there's a bad track on Come On Pilgrim, but it's much too short. Doolittle is about as close to perfection as any Pixies album to me.

4. Modest Mouse - This is a Long Drive... ---- A very nicely modulated album. Great pacing; I have this on vinyl and each side makes me want to hear the next.

5. Stephen Malkmus & the Jicks - Pig Lib ---- Maybe the best classic rock album of 2003. If there's any justice in the world people will talk about this one years from now.

Close but no cigar honorable mentions....
American Analog Set - Know By Heart
Belle and Sebastian - If You're Feeling Sinister
Neutral Milk Hotel - In An Aeroplane Over The Sea
Fugazi - End Hits
Tortoise - TNT

[Kameek N Deesha]

American Music Club - Everclear
Slint - Spiderland
Magnetic Fields - 69 Love Songs
Silver Jews - Natural Bridge
Yo La Tengo - I Can Hear The Heart Beating As One

Now I yam a white devil, yo!

Pains me not to mention Will Olham or Edith Frost or Royal Trux or Baba Manning or Bill Callahan or or or...

[Paul Davis]

Neutral Milk Hotel - In The Aeroplane Over The Sea
Pavement - Wowee Zowee
The Shins - Oh, Inverted World
Yo La Tengo - I Can Hear The Heart Beating As One
The New Pornographers - Electric Version

Almost good enough...
The Flaming Lips - In A Priest Driven Ambulance

[kgwang]

1 Superchunk "foolish"
2 Sebadoh "bakesale"
3 Archers of Loaf "icky mettle"
4 Pavement "crooked rain, crooked rain"
5 Braid "the age of octeen"

[metthi]

this is so easy.

and this is official too.

gerard cosley would back me up on this.

5. brighten the corners by pavement the rock band

4. terror twilight by pavement the hip hop group

3. crooked rain, crooked rain, crooked rain by pavement the flamenco dancers

2. slanted and enchanted by pavement the timeless indie rock band

1. westing: by musket and sextant by the treble kickers.

no wait,

make that WOWEE ZOWEE, the white album of the americas.

god save the malkmus

[lenny]

For the sake of mixing things up I am going to give you the timeless(already proven..It's a done deal) and the ones that definetly should become timeless.
Timeless:
Pavement-S and E
Pixies- Doolittle
Sonic Youth- Daydream Nation
Modest Mouse- LCW
Yo La Tengo- I can hear...

This might make some of you cry on the inside but a haven't heard GBV and can not (for the life of me) find a copy of the Wrens-Secaucus (How can i get it?)

What should be:
Interpol- TOTBL
The D. Plan- Emergency and I
Elliot Smith- Either/Or (Representin' Portland)
New Pornographers- Mass Romantic
Bright Eyes- The Story is in the... ( when you make fun of me for this pick.. don't use the examples Pitchfork did in their reviews to call it mediocre... I already read it.)

[silvertrees]

here are my five , not in any particular order:

the soft bulletin- the flaming lips
you're living all over me- dinosaur jr
pavement- crooked rain, crooked rain
built to spill- keep it like a secret
guided by voices- bee thousand