TVT Records - sales up 53% ?

[bitterfruit]

There's an article in the April edition of Business 2.0 by Steve Gottlieb regarding file sharing, etc. and the state of CD sales from 2003 vs. 2002.

Highlights include:

- TVT sales in 2003 reached $75 million
- Major labels saw 13% drop in sales compared to previous year
- Other indie labels saw a mere .34% growth over previous year

It's a pretty shitty article, but several statements are a little interesting and create several questions.

1. Is a label really indie when it's reached 75 million duckets.
2. Not that I am asking for numbers, but is it safe to say that Beggars is smaller than TVT?
3. Gottlieb indicates that they sell a lot more records compared to other indie labels because of the "value proposition" and "better packaging, extensive liner notes, artwork, and other content." Note that he doesn't really say anything about the music being good or worthy, just that he's plastic has more value than others.

Are the numbers really true? As to their source of information, I have no idea.

Is TVT doing that much better than the rest of the indie world? You're probably asking, "Why does it fucking matter?" Don't know, but I find this shit fascinating.

[9000]

i am a numbers dweeb too.

can't answer your questions, but i'll add to the mix that yesterday's ny times' stated that "Exile in Guyville," has sold 430,000 copies in 11 years.

a couple more data points and we may just be able to reverse engineer the matador back catalog sales figures...

[Patrick]

TVT had an incredible year last year. The whole Lil Jon/Kings of Crunk/Crunk & Disorderly thing was off the hook. They were written up in Billboard for it. They dominate the top 10 independent chart.

Yes, they are still independent, in that they are wholly owned by Steve Gottlieb and are unaffiliated with any of the 5 big labels, who are still vastly larger than any indie.

Can't answer your Beggars question -- don't forget that Beggars is huge in the UK and Europe.

Another interesting point about TVT is that - very unusual for an indie label - they own their own manufacturing plant and branch distributor in the US.

Patrick

[Paul]

Originally posted by Patrick
Another interesting point about TVT is that - very unusual for an indie label - they own their own manufacturing plant and branch distributor in the US. It's amazing just how many people want to line your pockets with cash when you release compilation cds of TV show theme songs before any one else even thought to do it, in'nit?

[9000]

Originally posted by Paul
It's amazing just how many people want to line your pockets with cash when you release compilation cds of TV show theme songs before any one else even thought to do it, in'nit?

that and the NIN back catalog, no?

[Paul]

Originally posted by 9000
that and the NIN back catalog, no? Well, if by back catalog you mean Pretty Hate Machine and its corresponding singles, then yes. I remember there being some kind of hubbub with Reznor and TVT between the time of that first album and the Broken ep (which came out via Atlantic on Reznor's vanity label Nothing). Anyone know the dirt?

[bitterfruit]

With a 20% profit margin, Mr. Gottlieb is sittin' high on the hog.

[yardleyone]

i think that secretly canadian also does their own manufacturing and distribution. I know that they own bellweather, which makes their cds at least. but it will probably be a long while before they have a year like TVT did in 03

[bitterfruit]

Originally posted by Patrick

Another interesting point about TVT is that - very unusual for an indie label - they own their own manufacturing plant and branch distributor in the US.

Patrick

Seems like a rather risky proposition. Why would one want to get out of their core business and own another moving part?

[9000]

Originally posted by bitterfruit
Seems like a rather risky proposition. Why would one want to get out of their core business and own another moving part?

because: http://www.quickmba.com/strategy/vertical-integration/

[bitterfruit]

Sure, there are benefits to being able to control an upstream supplier, but why when it's a highly competitive industry dealing with commodity products? It comes down to a build v. buy decision.

My opinion, whether a $75 million or $75 thou indie label, why have the headache of owning a manufacturing plant? Are they in the business to put out good music or make plastic discs?

The upstream management/ownership thing makes much more sense in other industries. Kathy Lee Gifford and sweat shops for example.

[tinobeat]

Originally posted by bitterfruit
Are they in the business to put out good music or make plastic discs?

well, clearly they've grown to the point where the answer is: both.

They manufacture and distribute smaller indies, the only one that comes to mind is Vagrant (at least the more popular Vagrant releases). I'm sure that more than pays off.

makes sense to this guy...

[9000]

Originally posted by bitterfruit
Sure, there are benefits to being able to control an upstream supplier, but why when it's a highly competitive industry dealing with commodity products?

my guess is that in addition to music, steve gottlieb likes to make money - he did do a bunch of csfb (investment bank) commercials a few years back. if you're selling enough discs, you can potentially drive costs down even further by owning the manufacturing process. money and power, yo.

[bitterfruit]

Does the name Frank Quattrone ring a bell?