Matador and the RIAA ?

[thetao]

I searched your web board and couldn't find this topic anywhere...

What is the current relationship between Matator and the RIAA? I visit http://www.boycott-riaa.com occasionally, mostly to check their list of companies paying dues to the RIAA. The last time I checked (at least 6 months ago), Matador was not listed, but this time you are. I don't buy as many CD's as I used to, but I am gearing-up for a major purchase soon, and your answer will affect what I do. I'll still buy Matator CD's...but will buy them used.

Hopefully this isn't what I think it is.

Thanks,

Todd

[johansen smith]

I swear there needs to be an FAQ. this has been brought up many many times. No, Matador is not, has not, and will never be a member of the RIAA. and you know what, even if they were, the CDs and the music they contain don't magically change into something else if suddenly the label putting them out supports the RIAA.

[TheSadDebaser]

Oh, brother.

[Patrick]

Listen:

Fuck boycott the RIAA.

Fuck the RIAA.

Now you figure it out.

Patrick

[Paul]

Neither here nor there, Patrick, but did you finally get tired of asking them to remove Matador from the list? Seems like everytime someone there takes you off, someone else puts you back on.

[Miss Tasty Princess]

It seems more like every time there's an accusatory post that it's just a cut'n'paste diatribe no doubt cribbed from one peabrain to another.

[Patrick]

I certainly got tired of it, but I emailed the RIAA anyway - to the last person who took us off the list in 2003. Unsurprisingly, she no longer works there (or at least her email address doesn't work).

So I emailed the webmaster at the RIAA... no reply yet.

And I forwarded my emails to the RIAA to another pea-brain who emailed me a cut-and-paste letter about us being listed on their site.

Pea-brains. All pea-brains.

Patrick

[johansen smith]

more like pee-brains, amirite

[thetao]

Okay, well that clears the air a bit!

I still have to wonder why they'd list Matador when you have no connection with them? Are they so illogical and deluded that they make up relationships out of thin air? That would be a new and amusing low.

Todd

[Patrick]

I'll let someone else answer this one.

Patrick

[johansen smith]

I believe it all goes back to the distribution deal Matador had at one point with Capitol Records.

[Miss Tasty Princess]

This sums up a lot:

Here at Boycott-Riaa.com, we strongly urge you NOT to share RIAA music via p2p or other means (we don't nesessarily think it is "wrong", nor do we believe that it should even be considered "illegal" to do so, but we DO know that when you put RIAA tunes on p2p it only helps to promote the sales of our sworn enemy. Instead of giving them a free advertising campaign, let's "starve the beast" and only share independent music that admits that it WANTS to be shared!But they hate the RIAA for cracking down on sharing music that does not want to be shared. :rolleyes:

[Patrick]

I believe it all goes back to the distribution deal Matador had at one point with Capitol Records.

Could be that, or could be that they want to increase their credibility by listing as many indies as they can.

Patrick

[Patrick]

Here's a new group of which we are members:

Association of American Independent Music (http://www.a2im.org/) (A2IM)

Patrick

[TheSadDebaser]

That may be the single hippest board of directors I've ever heard of.

[Lukas]

Here's a new group of which we are members:

Association of American Independent Music (http://www.a2im.org/) (A2IM)

Patrick

Haha, it seems you are only members of organizations that aren't actually associated with you.

EDIT - wait are you under Beggars?

[Miss Tasty Princess]

Haha, it seems you are only members of organizations that aren't actually associated with you.

EDIT - wait are you under Beggars?They're under Choosers.

[tinobeat]

ahahaha

you're on a roll, man...

[Patrick]

we're not listed? We pay 'em enough money!

Patrick

[thetao]

Any update on this? I checked the RIAA site just now...and you're still listed. If you think it would help, I'll contact them myself. I have a thing about honesty.

Todd

[Moon Pix]

Surely Boycott-Riaa.com are just yet another bunch of frustrated ex-college students trying to take a stand against something in a Michael Moore-esque fashion.

Why bother choosing sides when both sides are just trying to get you to do what they want. The RIAA is trying to get you pay a suit and tie man so that you can listen to predominantly crap music and the other sides trying to get you to fight something thats so f***ing lame it isnt really worth the time fighting it.

The Boycott-Riaa.com folk should just stop being so petty and just listen to what they want and just leave everybody else alone surely?

How are we to know that the Boycott-Riaa.com folk don't have their own agendas?

[Miss Tasty Princess]

I have a thing about honesty.And I have a thing about street teamers.

I just did a search and every time someone has complained about Matador's alleged RIAA membership, it's been a new member making their first post. If the posters post count is higher than 1, then all subsequent posts have also been about the RIAA.

Perhaps I should've posted this in the WTF? thread . . .

[Patrick]

thetao, I'll send them another email. If you want to email me your address (I'm at patrick@matadorrecords.com), I'll cc you on it.

Patrick

[thetao]

Surely Boycott-Riaa.com are just yet another bunch of frustrated ex-college students trying to take a stand against something in a Michael Moore-esque fashion.

And is there anything wrong with that? Or have you become too downtrodden to be idealistic about anything? :)

Why bother choosing sides when both sides are just trying to get you to do what they want.

I don't follow the Boycott-Riaa bunch in lock-step. It's just a handy link to the list of RIAA-affiliated labels. I think they used to maintain their own list, but now it's just a link to the RIAA site. I'm tired of corporate America and special interest and decided to show a little discipline.

Changing the subject slightly, if several million people just chose to not buy copy proteced CD's, there wouldn't be any copy protected CD's today. But even tacitly approving of something you despise just prolongs the misery: "ooh, I'm gonna pay $16.99 for a protected CD and go out of my way to rip a copy that plays in my car, and that'll show 'em! Yep, that'll show 'em!"

The Boycott-Riaa.com folk should just stop being so petty and just listen to what they want and just leave everybody else alone surely?

If I'm bothering you, you can stop reading this thread any time. I'm only interested in bothering the RIAA and those companies who support them. In this case, Matador is the victim, and I don't want the RIAA's listing to hurt their sales. Not everybody is going to come here asking questions first, y'know?

How are we to know that the Boycott-Riaa.com folk don't have their own agendas?

Umm, I think you're being a little paranoid now. :)

[thetao]

And I have a thing about street teamers.

I just did a search and every time someone has complained about Matador's alleged RIAA membership, it's been a new member making their first post. If the posters post count is higher than 1, then all subsequent posts have also been about the RIAA.

Street teamers?? I just knew I wasn't cool. :(

Actually, I somtimes wonder about people who post thousands messages to web boards they don't administrate. Nothing personal, but I usually have better things to do. Most people will only give you feedback when they're upset about something. Any business will tell you that.

[thetao]

thetao, I'll send them another email. If you want to email me your address (I'm at patrick@matadorrecords.com), I'll cc you on it.

On the way. Thanks, man!

[johansen smith]

I actually thought Moonpix's post was the sanest response yet to this madness.

[Miss Tasty Princess]

Actually, I somtimes wonder about people who post thousands messages to web boards they don't administrate. Nothing personal, but I usually have better things to do.Yeah, I'm really wasting my time what with my post average of 1.21 posts per day here, according to my profile. God, when do I sleep?

I wonder about people who get so hot under the collar that they register with a company's message board to post a complaint rather than simply e-mailing the label directly via their contact page (http://www.matadorrecords.com/matadorinfo/staff.html) to find out if their accusations are well grounded.

[Elijah]

I can't believe you're all fighting about this.




That's all.

[Miss Tasty Princess]

I can't believe you're all fighting about this.Agreed. I will leave Mr. Street Teamer alone.

[Moon Pix]

I actually thought Moonpix's post was the sanest response yet to this madness.

Thankyou. I just see it that the RIAA and the mainstream music industry is so lame thats its not really worth fighting them. If they even had anything resembling any conviction then maybe yes but all it seems to be over is the file sharing. Home taping didnt kill music and I doubt very much that file sharing will either. I still think that the majority of people would buy an album from the record store or from the labels site if they liked it.

I agee with TheTao though, Matador are the only real victims here. If theyre being listed falsely in order to create a backlash against them then it is worth trying to get them unlisted. I don't see any point in fighting the music industry though. If you like an album by an artist on a major label that shouldnt stop you from buying it if you want to. I don't know about you but most of the cds that I buy are on indie labels anyway.

[Moon Pix]

And is there anything wrong with that? Or have you become too downtrodden to be idealistic about anything? :)

Not really but there is an awful lot of it, wether its Al Franken or The Corporation. I would have thought that people's time and money would be better spent enjoying themselves, rather than raging against the machine or whatever, especially when its a lame machine (in this case the mainstream music industry of America).

I don't follow the Boycott-Riaa bunch in lock-step. It's just a handy link to the list of RIAA-affiliated labels. I think they used to maintain their own list, but now it's just a link to the RIAA site. I'm tired of corporate America and special interest and decided to show a little discipline.

I think its silly. Music is all about sound and emotion, not ideals (unless your name is Ian McKaye who I just find to be irritating). Chan sang on the Cingular commercial. Does that change anything about her? Not in my opinion. I didnt refuse to buy The Greatest because "she's sold out" because she hasnt.

Changing the subject slightly, if several million people just chose to not buy copy proteced CD's, there wouldn't be any copy protected CD's today. But even tacitly approving of something you despise just prolongs the misery: "ooh, I'm gonna pay $16.99 for a protected CD and go out of my way to rip a copy that plays in my car, and that'll show 'em! Yep, that'll show 'em!"

The problem though is convincing the majority of music buyers to boycott something all at once. I doubt that most people are really that bothered about what label something is released on, as long as they like it they don't care. Boycotts of major labels only ever hurt the artist. If for example everybody boycotts Black Rebel Motorcycle Club's record because theyve just signed to a major label the record label doesnt really care because Beyonces record sold a million copies last week and theyre on the same label (sorry if theyre not- Im just using these as examples of indie and pop respectively). BMRC get dropped and get written off as a bad investment and the label rides Beyonce all the way to the bank. Who loses out? BMRC or the major label with more money than Cresus?

In closing, I do believe that the best course of action regarding this whole situation is to not boycott things you don't like but rather to support things you do like. Supporting the AAIM is a lot more helpful in the long run than fighting the RIAA. Isnt it more helpful to increase Matador's share than to decrease Sony's?

The boycott-RIAA.com folk are the worst bunch out of the lot because who knows what their motivations are? At least we KNOW that the RIAA are arseholes. The boycott-RIAA people could be worse or better... but either way they arent letting on.

[Elijah]

When the RIAA first began suing their customers over file sharing, my reaction was one of self-righteous indignation. Now, when I stack that up against everything else that's fucked up about the world, the RIAA's strong-arm tactics seem rather insignificant. I don't agree with their position, but I can only dedicate my energy to so many causes, and this one is pretty far towards the bottom of the list.

[9000]

turn in your che guevara t-shirts and pick up a pair of these (http://www.cafepress.com/boycottriaa.7214321) if you're really down with the movement, people.

[Keith]

Ok i'm a bit late, but who are the RIAA? Do i really need to know or should i just go about my daily work.

[johansen smith]

Ok i'm a bit late, but who are the RIAA? Do i really need to know or should i just go about my daily work.
I believe you're in the UK so it doesn't really affect you at all, but it's something like the Recording Industry Artists of America. basically a watchdog group protecting major label interests. since the invent of file sharing has causes mainstream music fans to merely download the singles from an album rather than buy the album for two or three songs surrounded by filler, major labels in the US have been losing money, as unlike the UK, the US has a very weak singles market and has beeen predominately an singles-lead yet album-oriented business. thus major labels are looking for someone to blame for their own growing superflousity, and those who share music online are the scapegoats.

[Keith]

Thank-you.

[mayorbloomberg]

I think its silly. Music is all about sound and emotion, not ideals (unless your name is Ian McKaye who I just find to be irritating).


Wow! I can't believe that you think that Fugazi, let alone MINOR THREAT never had anything to do with emotion, let alone SOUND.

The problem though is convincing the majority of music buyers to boycott something all at once. I doubt that most people are really that bothered about what label something is released on, as long as they like it they don't care. Boycotts of major labels only ever hurt the artist. If for example everybody boycotts Black Rebel Motorcycle Club's record because theyve just signed to a major label the record label doesnt really care because Beyonces record sold a million copies last week and theyre on the same label (sorry if theyre not- Im just using these as examples of indie and pop respectively). BMRC get dropped and get written off as a bad investment and the label rides Beyonce all the way to the bank. Who loses out? BMRC or the major label with more money than Cresus?

Actually, Beyonce is better than BMRC.


Other than that I think that you make great points. The thing to keep in mind here is that we don't know how the age of Thetao. We all (at least those of us over 30) know how much harder it is to be idealistic at this late stage of your life. Like someone else said, you have to prioritize your causes. And we also know how easy it was to be riled up when you were young.
One day Thetao will wake up worrying about his lack of a 401(k) plan (as I did just today) and the RIAA will be the least of his concerns.

[Moon Pix]

Wow! I can't believe that you think that Fugazi, let alone MINOR THREAT never had anything to do with emotion, let alone SOUND.

I don't really. Im not into Fugazi or Minor Threat but I do think that they are about emotion and sound. Sometimes though I think Ian's been a bit too righteous and holier than thou and he seems to have made a bigger deal about how his music is distributed and so on than what it actually sounds like.

[mayorbloomberg]

I don't really. Im not into Fugazi or Minor Threat but I do think that they are about emotion and sound. Sometimes though I think Ian's been a bit too righteous and holier than thou and he seems to have made a bigger deal about how his music is distributed and so on than what it actually sounds like.

Huh. I mean I rarely even see interviews with him, except for maybe in Punk Planet or something where most people would not find it holier than thou.

Anyway, I am sure this is another whole thread, but I will say this:
I think that if Ian McKaye wants to pat himself and his friends (because I know he always mentions them) on the back that is A-OK. We all know what he has done, it doesn't need to be rehashed here. And he deserves all the praise he gets. If you knew him you would not think he was self righteous or holier than thou and I understand that you don't.

And I say that having just said and MEANT that Beyonce is better than BMRC.

[Moon Pix]

From what Ive read he probably had no choice. To my knowledge there wasnt much of a punk rock circuit when Minor Threat started. He should be proud of himself. The only problem is that some people have taken it upon themselves to run their lives by it. I can't really blame him though. I know he doesnt like being credited with the straight edge movement because of some of the dogmatic people who've turned it into a self righteous stance.

[mayorbloomberg]

We have come to a consensus.

[Dave]

I don't really. Im not into Fugazi or Minor Threat but I do think that they are about emotion and sound. Sometimes though I think Ian's been a bit too righteous and holier than thou and he seems to have made a bigger deal about how his music is distributed and so on than what it actually sounds like.


I have to say that you are just plain wrong on this one. Like many before you, I think you are thinking about a more fictionalizied Ian McKaye. Just because he has a very specific ways of conducting his bands and label's activities does not mean that he expects or requires others to do so. These lazy attitudes often obscure one of the finest bands of all time.
Dave

[Moon Pix]

I have to say that you are just plain wrong on this one. Like many before you, I think you are thinking about a more fictionalizied Ian McKaye. Just because he has a very specific ways of conducting his bands and label's activities does not mean that he expects or requires others to do so. These lazy attitudes often obscure one of the finest bands of all time.
Dave

Sorry everybody, Im always ready to apologise if Im wrong and when talking to somebody who knows more than me. As we know the press are arseholes who often paint people as something they're not (in this case I can blame Michael Azerrad or at least my interpretation of what he wrote in that book of his). Can I just ask - is this sort of misrepresentation true in the case of Albini?

[japanese_moon]

401(k) plan

I have one of these.

[Dave]

Sorry everybody, Im always ready to apologise if Im wrong and when talking to somebody who knows more than me. As we know the press are arseholes who often paint people as something they're not (in this case I can blame Michael Azerrad or at least my interpretation of what he wrote in that book of his). Can I just ask - is this sort of misrepresentation true in the case of Albini?

No, not really. In person I have always found Steve Albini to be a very nice human being. You have to remember that a lot of times people are looking for a very specfic response to topics and they ask leading questions. And while I am not saying that you are doing or have done this, but a lot of times folks seem to enjoy simplifying peoples views on subjects for their own ends.
As for Mr. Azerrad's book I will say this: I certainly enjoyed more than I thought I would, but please remember that it is a very broad overview. Each one of the bands covered could fill a book twice the size.

Dave

[Moon Pix]

You have to remember that a lot of times people are looking for a very specfic response to topics and they ask leading questions. And while I am not saying that you are doing or have done this, but a lot of times folks seem to enjoy simplifying peoples views on subjects for their own ends.

I met Chan after a show once and she told me about it, that the artist-journalist relationship basically consists of journalists leading you on in interviews and trying to get the answers they want. Nick Cave said something similar once too, something like "people think Im a miserable old sod but its only because I get asked such miserable bloody questions."

Since I met her Ive refused to believe a lot of stuff I read in interviews and I suppose I should have suspected it with Ian just as I suspect with Bill Callahan and many others. I doubt he's really that miserable and anti-social.

[Joel]

Can I just ask - is this sort of misrepresentation true in the case of Albini?

I completely concur with Dave. In my (relatively limited) experience, Steve has been one of the best people I've ever conducted business with, or even met, in the "business." His "bad rep" is mostly based on willful misinterpretation at best, and complete obliviousness at worst, to/of his general aesthetic (ie. sarcasm, artistic license, etc.).

In general, though, the speculation about "what musicians are really like" just seems so lame to me. Isn't the music enough? I don't personally need to know whether x dude in band y is a jerk or not, unless y'know there's an actual reason to interact with said dude (or dudette). Just my two cents.