Matador listed as one of the ten best indie labels of all time in new issue! [Archive]

tinobeat

04-18-2003, 02:08 AM

Originally posted by Paul
Why is the logo for Rough Trade follow by the bio for Factory?

And why did K get the nod over Kill Rock Stars?

I hate to be presumptuous, but I'll put forward the argument that KRS (or any of the other wonderful non-K things to come out of OlyWa) wouldn't have happened without K.

I'll second the Homestead over Gravity vote, and I'll say to Johansen: Up Records did some DAMN fine work, but hasn't created the classics I believe the others have, and since Chris Takino passed on (RIP), it really hasn't done much of note other than the vinyl issues of BTS/Doug Martsch. Drag City should definitely be on there, IMO, maybe instead of 4AD or Sub Pop... but that's because DC has been tons more important to me than those two (admittedly influential) labels.

btw: Mr. HCI, you can't drop a teaser like "I used to be on Homestead" without revealing the capacity in which you were on the label.. c'mon... fess up!

lightupthesky

04-18-2003, 03:15 AM

Thanks for the responses. I am glad most of you agreed with the majority of labels listed. To the person who pointed out the Rough Trade logo, THANK YOU! I let that slip by me somehow...but it did let the cat out of the bag as to who almost beat out Factory. So yea, thanks again for mentioning that.

All the labels you've mentioned were strong canidates, (minus IMO, which I've never heard of...someone wanna clue me in?). Drag City was up there, but got taken off last minute in consideration that SubPop and Matador were on, and also because I felt there wasn't a strong 90's experimental hardcore label being represented...that's why Gravity made it in last minute. UP Records...ehhh? I dunno, never attained the cult status that most the rest had. The only one I really pained over not putting in was Creation Records. It was either Creation or 4AD...I still can't tell if I made the right choice.

In case you were wondering, if it went top 20, the second half would've looked like this...

11.) Creation
12.) Drag City
13.) Mute
14.) Rough Trade
15.) Kill Rock Stars
16.) Estrus
17.) Slash
18.) Warp (though may be disqualified for being IDM)
19.) Troubleman Unlimited
20.) Parlaphone (though I'm still not sure if they were initially independent or always a part of a major)

Miss Tasty Princess

04-18-2003, 06:00 AM

lightupthesky: Homestead didn't even make the top 20? Are you just not familiar with them or what?

Tinobeat: check my profile

tinobeat

04-18-2003, 11:39 AM

word..

homestead, I think, never really appeared on the radar for most people (including myself) who got into their indie rock after '93-'94 or so. only old farts remember homestead...

just kidding. but seriously, for the under 27 indie rock set, Homestead really wasn't around during the formative years of descent into the underground.

Miss Tasty Princess

04-18-2003, 02:12 PM

The absurd thing to me (about overlooking them) is a good deal of the artists on the labels selected got their start on Homestead.

tinobeat

04-18-2003, 05:01 PM

well that's exactly the thing...

As far as I know (and I don't know much about indie rock pre-'93 or so), Homestead was the place it all started, but didn't necessarily produce as many "classic" albums that are touted as being essential in the indie rock "canon." But then again, that comes from my perspective of being a 24-year old who got into underground rock around '96 or so.

I think the only Homestead record I own is the Bastro Diablo Guapo LP. For me, Homestead is sort of a legendary label that everyone was on before they went on to wherever they went to get more famous...

lightupthesky

04-18-2003, 09:19 PM

My arguement against Homestead is the same that tinobeat made, they didn't release as many "classic albums" as some of the others. Granted, they had a good roster, but none of those albums were as monumental. I could be having a memory lapse, but I just can't recall anything that phenominal about the label. Jog my memory, list what you think are classics off Homestead.

johansen smith

04-18-2003, 09:45 PM

Miss Tasty Princess

04-18-2003, 11:00 PM

Off the top of my head (out of well over 100 releases, I'm pretty sure but Gerard would certainly know better than me):

Big Black Racer X
Big Black Atomizer
Dinosaur debut
Sebadoh first three albums
Honor Role Rictus
Squirrel Bait Squirrel Bait
Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds The Firstborn Is Dead
Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds Your Funeral . . . My Trial
Sonic Youth Bad Moon Rising
The Frogs It's Only Right and Natural
Membranes Songs of Love and Fury
Membranes Kiss Ass . . . Godhead!
My Dad Is Dead Let's Skip the Details
My Dad Is Dead The Shorter You Are the Taller You Get
The Chills Brave Words
Verlaines Hallelujah All the Way Home
Einstürzende Neubauten Strategies Against Architecture
Volcano Suns The Bright Orange Years
Live Skull Bringing Home the Bait
Live Skull Cloud One
Swans Raping a Slave
Green River Come on Down
Bastro Sing the Troubled Beast
Death of Samantha Where the Women Wear the Glory and the Men Wear the Pants
Death of Samantha Come All Ye Faithless
Naked Raygun Throb, Throb
Gibson Bros Dedicated Fool
Big Dipper Heavens

Funk

04-18-2003, 11:06 PM

Originally posted by lightupthesky
My arguement against Homestead is the same that tinobeat made, they didn't release as many "classic albums" as some of the others. Granted, they had a good roster, but none of those albums were as monumental. I could be having a memory lapse, but I just can't recall anything that phenominal about the label. Jog my memory, list what you think are classics off Homestead.

(Some of these are entirely subjective, possibly the two I've listened to in the last couple of days)

HMS 008 Naked Raygun, Throb Throb LP/CD/CS
HMS 011 Speed Trials Compilation LP/CS
HMS 015 Dinosaur, Dinosaur LP/CS
HMS 016 Sonic Youth, Bad Moon Rising LP/CD/CS
HMS 017 Swans, Raping A Slave 12"EP
HMS 021 Sonic Youth, Death Valley '69 12"EP
HMS 026 Nick Cave And The Bad Seeds, The Firstborn Is Dead LP/CD/CS
HMS 028 Squirrel Bait, Squirrel Bait LP/CS
HMS 039 Death Of Samantha, Strungout On Jargon LP
HMS 043 Big Black, Atomizer LP/CS
HMS 063 Einstürzende Neubauten, Strategies Against Architecture LP/CD/CS
HMS 107 GG Allin, Freaks, Faggots, Drunks And Junkies LP/CD/CS
HMS 142 Daniel Johnston, Yip Jump Music, 2xLP/CD/CS
HMS 146 My Dad is Dead, The Taller You Are The Shorter You Get 2XLP/CD/CS
HMS 165 Sebadoh, Gimmie Indie Rock 7"
HMS 168 Sebadoh, III 2xLP/CD/CS
HMS 173 Styrenes, It's Artastic CD
HMS 174 Electric Eels, The God Says Fuck You CD
HMS 185 Lovechild, Witchcraft LP/CD/CS
HMS 209 Truman's Water, Godspeed The Punchline LP/CD

This has to top Gravity and their "well, the Rapture album is okay" discography.

Parlaphone was the Beatles label as well, so I have no idea how you even considered that one.

Tinobeat: "but seriously, for the under 27 indie rock set, Homestead really wasn't around during the formative years of descent into the underground."

I'm 27, I think two of these albums were released after I entered my teens (and I sure wasn't listening to the Swans at 8 years old). The age thing is a pretty bad excuse for blowing off the label. Motown's heyday was years before you were born, and you know their stuff, don't you?

Gerard

04-19-2003, 08:41 AM

good point, Dr., but Motown's history has been chronicled a little better (the made for tv movies about Berry Gordy are much better than the made for tv movies about me and Ken Katkin). And more importantly, much of Motown's classic catalog is still in print.

other Homestead (personal) favorites than may or may not be more meaningful than Gravity's illustrious output :

Owt
Fish & Roses
Rhys Chatham
Phantom Tollbooth
Uzi
The Flies
Salem 66

and of course, the Happy Flowers

GC

threelobed

04-19-2003, 09:32 AM

and of course, the Happy Flowers

classics like "mom i gave the cat some acid" alone top some of the collected output of some of these other labels. happy flowers = good, good stuff...

tinobeat

04-19-2003, 01:33 PM

Originally posted by Funk
I'm 27, I think two of these albums were released after I entered my teens (and I sure wasn't listening to the Swans at 8 years old). The age thing is a pretty bad excuse for blowing off the label. Motown's heyday was years before you were born, and you know their stuff, don't you?

well, its like Gerard said, you can't really compare Homestead and Motown.

and I think I made it clear that I was saying that from my perspective of really not knowing that much about late 80's indie, Homestead means little to me. The fact that i know more about it than Gravity and knowing that it had far more impact than gravity makes me sure that it should be on the list instead.

and come on, every label I don't know that much about is "blown off?"

And also, I know Motown in as much I as I probably know a lot of stuff that was/is on it if I was to hear it, but I doubt I could name that many Motown artists off the top of my head, just because I know the artists but not necessarily the labels they were on then. All my favorite soul music is on Rhino, Sundazed, and 4 Men With Beards. I don't necessarily know what label Otis Redding was on originally, for example...

I guess that makes me not as scholarly as I hope to be...

Funk

04-19-2003, 06:18 PM

Originally posted by tinobeat
well, its like Gerard said, you can't really compare Homestead and Motown.

(...)

And also, I know Motown in as much I as I probably know a lot of stuff that was/is on it if I was to hear it, but I doubt I could name that many Motown artists off the top of my head, just because I know the artists but not necessarily the labels they were on then. All my favorite soul music is on Rhino, Sundazed, and 4 Men With Beards. I don't necessarily know what label Otis Redding was on originally, for example...

The Motown thing was set up as a "well, a music fan would be aware of the legendary roster even though its best days are behind it" (if any Canadian mentions Remy Shand, I'll hunt you down and kill you), and Homestead was an important label for indie rock, so I was assuming an _indie rock_ fan would at least be aware of what it offered at one time (and shame on you, living in Boston and being so oblivious).

Surprise! Otis Redding is on Rhino, Sundazed and 4 Men With Beards! (all licensed from Atlantic, who stole him from Stax thru a very bad licensing deal)

History is fun(k)!

jef

04-21-2003, 01:13 PM

Just by looking at those lists above, there are more than a few "Classics" on there.

jef

04-21-2003, 01:24 PM

As far as Gravity goes, I think it depends on who you ask, but they were very influential to many people. Bands like Unwound, Clikatat Ikatowi, MITB, Antioch Arrow, Heroin, 3 Mile Pilot, & UOA were some of my favorite bands.

Paul

04-21-2003, 09:23 PM

Having looked at Gravity's roster, though, I'm inclined to pigeonhole the label as a niche market. Homestead, on the other hand, has a little something for everybody.

Miss Tasty Princess

04-21-2003, 11:25 PM

Much as I love Three Mile Pilot, the majority of their releases were on Headhunter/Cargo and I'm not sure I've heard of any of the other bands you listed on Gravity.

DefenderOfPants

04-22-2003, 12:26 AM

is MERGE not an indie label?

Paul

04-22-2003, 12:30 AM

Yeah, Merge is an indie label (and a good one at that), but they didn't really become a sizable contributor until the mid-90s -- long after others had already established themselves. Also, the fact that most bands on Merge recorded elsewhere first doesn't help strengthen their case for inclusion.

winterwooskie

04-22-2003, 01:34 AM

Originally posted by threelobed
classics like "mom i gave the cat some acid" alone top some of the collected output of some of these other labels. happy flowers = good, good stuff...

hehe, i forgot about that song. i got sonic youth's version of the song from kazaa about a year ago and lost it when my computer died. it's hilarious. my brother used to make fun of me by playing that song. and my sister liked that song alot and used to sing it. a ten year old screaming "mom, i gave the cat some acid," is hysterical.

and to the board people. why did i lose my old name nomorefunfun? i'm not on the board that much, but posted recently i think so it's not because it was inactive or anything.

jef

04-22-2003, 01:11 PM

I definately agree that Gravity bands are a niche market, and I would definately say as a whole, that Homestead is more influential. Still, I hold Gravity close to my heart because those were some great times for me, and a lot of other people mainly in California, and there were some truly unique bands.

Yeah I think 3 Mile Pilot only put out their last s/t ep on Gravity.

anagrama

04-24-2003, 05:23 AM

If the list could go to 20 I would definitely throw Epitaph and Sonic Unyon in there. Grand Royal was pretty good back in its day too, but they were a scam indie...methinks?

anagrama

04-24-2003, 05:24 AM

Originally posted by tinobeat
word..

homestead, I think, never really appeared on the radar for most people (including myself) who got into their indie rock after '93-'94 or so. only old farts remember homestead...

just kidding. but seriously, for the under 27 indie rock set, Homestead really wasn't around during the formative years of descent into the underground.

the young'ns learned about Homestead by reading the Sonic Youth book...confusion is next. It talked greatly about some kid named Gerard who was this big fanboy/promoter/label manager.

I wonder what ended up happening to that kid.

mac

04-24-2003, 10:40 AM

ok. I have to agree with Mr. HCI on this one. Homestead, the Cosloy years, was extremely influential on my formative listening years. though, I suppose I can be considered an 'old fart' by many around here. Perhaps many records from the Homestead years are difficult to track down at this point, but so what? doesn't make them any less significant. Fact is, Homestead was releasing great records by great bands throughout the mid 80's and into the early 90's. Many that evolved into your favorite's favorite OF today. (or at least had a big influence on them). that you weren't paying attention, or haven't paid attention since 'coming of age' isn't the label's fault. extinct or not, the very same zietgeist (albiet grown up and stuff) inhabits the spirit of here at Matador. seems to me, anyhow. though nobody asked me ....

..off the top of my head: Sonic youth, Dinosaur (pre jr.), Naked Raygun, Death of Samantha, Big Black, loads of NZ stuff, Great Plains, Happy Flowers, Nice Strong Arm, Green River, Squirrelbait/Bastro, Fish and Roses, Breaking Circus... um, um..

...and many more I am sure i'm forgetting at the moment. remember, i'm old.

jef

04-24-2003, 12:34 PM

They did have some amazing bands.

Mac or Mr. HCI, What is a good album by Death of Samantha to pick up?

mac

04-24-2003, 01:34 PM

hey jef

get either Come All Ye Faithless OR Where The Women Wear The Glory And The Men Wear The Pants. you'll be in great shape. this is NOT to say Strungout On Jargon isn't totally worthwhile. it is....

really ...

...you can't go wrong, either way ...

jef

04-24-2003, 01:56 PM

Thanks.

Miss Tasty Princess

04-24-2003, 02:13 PM

I am in complete agreement with mac on DoS. If you like the three albums then you'll also want the Laughing in the Face of a Dead Man EP and the three singles they released. Then you'll want to check out singer/songwriter John Petkovic's newer (and most excellent) band, Cobra Verde.

jef

04-24-2003, 03:48 PM

I'm already familiar with Cobra Verde's stuff, just never really got a DOS album.

winterwooskie

04-24-2003, 04:44 PM

i was too young to know of homestead when it was around but about their albums being out of print and difficult to find, you could always check the bargain bin-(we just want to get rid of this junk and are selling them for only a couple dollars each)-section. i found a my dad is dead tape for a couple dollars. that's the only homestead album i have. and if it were not for a great review that i read in a matador catalog from a few years back, i wouldn't have bought it.

Miss Tasty Princess

04-24-2003, 05:34 PM

Now you need the rest of the My Dad Is Dead catalog! A new one came out last year, The Engine of Commerce, and it's most excellent. There's an official MDID website with more info here (http://mdid10.home.mindspring.com/index.htm).

mac

04-24-2003, 06:56 PM

well...

what do you think of Out Of Sight, Out OF Mind and For Richer ,For Poorer ?

the only two less than stellar ones in the bunch, if my memory serves correct. however, Everyone Wants The Honey But Not The Sting was an nice, grim, chop-and-burn, return to form.

did I miss the boat on the aforementioned two?

Miss Tasty Princess

04-24-2003, 08:55 PM

Nope, I'd agree that, while good, those are the least of his albums.

beekeeper

05-02-2003, 06:37 AM

well, while I am glad they made the list, I'm kinda hurt that they were the "last ones in"--they were horrifically influential not only on the community of independent music (perhaps the very first somewhat notable indie label) but wider industry in general. I'm glad they were recognized, but the "last one in" status kinda smarts :(...oh well.

Dave

05-02-2003, 12:51 PM

I'd like to cast a big vote in favor of Out Of Sight Out Of Mind . I absolutely love the guitar sound on that record. I suggest going back and giving it another listen. I also think that while the new album is a welcome return it does suffer from being a bit too long. You know: CD disease.
That double 7" that came out on Scat years ago is another winner.
three cheers for My Dad is Dead.
Dave

Funk

05-02-2003, 02:56 PM

Originally posted by Dave
I'd like to cast a big vote in favor of Out Of Sight Out Of Mind . I absolutely love the guitar sound on that record. I suggest going back and giving it another listen. I also think that while the new album is a welcome return it does suffer from being a bit too long. You know: CD disease.

Having spent the better part of the last month listening to all of MDID's albums almost exclusively, I would have to say the sound on Out of Sight... really hampers it from taking place among the highs of his discography. I seem to recall from the MDID biography that used to be online that something happened to the Beat Farm studio in the middle of recording and they almost lost the tapes to damage, and were lucky to have been able to salvage it.

I don't know if I agree with the assessment that the new album is too long (my favourite album by him is the double vinyl version of The Taller You Are The Shorter You Get, which is considerably longer than the 72 minute CD version), but I think there's a few too many lesser songs on it and the fact it was recorded over so many years doesn't give it a very cohesive feel. It's more like the Shine(r) CD; a great collection with an okay flow to it.